| Subject: Militia
defector names top generals involved Radio
Nederland Gema Warta, 6 October 1999
BAIS chief, Tyasno Sudarto named for his involvement in
actions by pro autonomy militias.
The chief of the Indonesian armed forces' intelligence
agency, BAIS (formerly called BIA), Lt General Tyasno Sudarto took part in preparatory
meetings for pro-autonomy militia operations from March this year. This is the first time
the name of Tyasno, former commander of the Diponegoro Regional Command (Central Java) and
a close asssociate of General Wiranto, has been mentioned in connection with the violent
actions in East Timor. Tyasno as also once BAIS protocol directorate chief, whose duty it
was to protect President Suharto during his trips abroad.
The UN Commission of Inquiry will soon be going to East
Timor to begin investigating human rights violations since January this year. Until now
names mentioned in New York, Geneva, Darwin, Dili and Jakarta have included former BAIS
chief Major-General Zacky Anwar, Major General Gleny Kauripan, Udayana Regional commander,
Major General Adam Damiri, former Jakarta military commander Major-General Syafrie
Syamsuddin and, former military commander in East Timor, Colonel Tono Suratman.
According to Tomas Goncalves, the man chosen to head the
militia in Ermera, Tyasno also attended meetings with militia leaders. Tomas Gonzalves was
formerly bupati of Ermera. He is the son of the second governor of East Timor, Guilherme
Maria Gonzalves who defected to Portugal in the 1990s. Tomas defected last April and is
now staying in Macao. Here is what he had to say in an interview with Radio Nederland:
Tomas Gonzalves (TG): I was also nominated to become the
bupati (district chief) of Ermera.
RN: Then, did you defect?
TG: Yes, I refuse (to do things) because the things I saw
were too brutal and cruel. That's why I refused.
RN: Was that in April after the Liquica incident?
TG: Yes, on 5 April I was in Dili and on the 6 April I left
Dili for Jakarta.
RN: How did it happen that you were appointed to command
the militias?
TG: As you know, in 1975, I was commander of a joint
command, having been a partisan. Then I was appointed as bupati until 1988.
RN: Bupati of which region?
TG: Of Ermera.
RN: What were your duties as head of the militias?
TG: We had to wage as much resistance as possible to anyone
who was pro-independence. This all began back in February this year.
RN: Who was in charge? Which generals were involved?
TG: One of the generals was Major-/General ZAcky Anwar, as
well as the Head of BIA himself (BIA is now called BAIS).
RN: Who was the head of BIA? WAs his name Tyanso Sudarto.
TG: Yes that's right, Tyasno. And there was also Gleny.
RN: Gleny Kaupiran?
TG: Yes.
RD: What was his position?
TG: I dont know for sure, but these are the ones who I
knew.
RN: Did you ever attend meetings at which they were
present?
TG: Yes, often.
RN: What did they say? What was the aim of the operations?
Did you have to murder people? What were your orders?
RG: We pro-autonomy people had to defend the motherland. It
was said that East Timor was integrated into Indonesia.
RN: In what way did you have to defend integration?
TG: We had to take up arms, if we were defeated.
RN: Who were the enemy, and what did you have to do to
them?
TG: The enemy were the leaders of CNRT, as well as their
sympathisers, down to their grandchildren.
RN: What did you have to do to them?
TG: We had to kill them.
RN: Did they actually say that? Did you hear them say that
or read about in the programme?
TG: Yes I heard in and re.... it as well. I know for
certain that this is what they said.
RN: Did people like Major-General Adam Damiri or Zacky
Anwar, or Tyasno Sudarto say this? That those people had to be killed?
TG: Well, not directly but via Colonel Tono Suratman and
the SGI (Kopassus intelligence agency) commander.
RN: Who was the SGI commander at the time?
TG: Colonel Nugroho. But later he was replaced by ....
There was another replacement as well who is probably still in Dili... Yayat Sudradjat.
RN: Is he a colonel?
TG: At the time he was still a lieutenant colonel.
RN: How often did you hear about this programme to finish
off the leaders of the CNRT? Since when?
TG: Since March
TAPOL, the Indonesia Human Rights Campaign 111 Northwood
Road, Thornton Heath, Surrey CR7 8HW, UK Phone: 0181 771-2904 Fax: 0181 653-0322 email:
tapol@gn.apc.org Internet: www.gn.apc.org/tapol Campaigning to expose human rights
violations in Indonesia, East Timor, West Papua and Aceh
25 years - and still going strong
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